TWELVE THINGS ALL MPs SHOULD KNOW BEFORE VOTING

TO PUMP ANOTHER $172 MILLION FOR THE GUN REGISTRY

By Garry Breitkreuz, MP – March 7, 2003

1.  THE AUDITOR GENERAL REPORTED THAT SHE WAS UNABLE TO DETERMINE THE TOTAL COST OF THE GUN REGISTRY FROM THE INFORMATION PROVIDED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE.

A.  The information the Department provided states that by 2001-02 it has spent about $688 million on the Program and collected about $59 million in revenues after refunds. We believe that this information does not fairly present the cost of the Program to the government. 

Source: Report of the Auditor General of Canada – December 2002, Paragraph 10.2 – Page 1.

http://www.oag-bvg.gc.ca/domino/reports.nsf/html/20021210ce.html/$file/20021210ce.pdf

 

B.  Mr. Chair, we asked the department to give us a financial statement of the costs of the program. We wanted to audit that. It was a very simple, straight financial audit. We had great difficulty getting the information in the form that we asked for. We had great difficulty getting complete information. That is what we were reporting to you today.

Source:  Testimony of Mrs. Sheila Fraser, Auditor General of Canada before the House of Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues].

2. THE AUDITOR GENERAL REPORTED THAT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT FAILED TO REPORT THE “WIDER COSTS” OF THE GUN REGISTRY AS REQUIRED BY THE GOVERNMENT’S REGULATORY POLICY.

In 2000, the Department of Justice estimated that by 2004-05 it would spend at least $1 billion on the Program and collect $140 million in fees after refunds. This amount does not include all financial impacts on the government. The Department also did not report to Parliament on the wider costs of the Program as required by the government's regulatory policy.

Source: Report of the Auditor General of Canada – December 2002, Paragraph 10.3 – Page 1.

3.  THE AUDITOR GENERAL REPORTED THAT THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE FAILED TO REPORT THE COSTS OF ENFORCING THE FIREARMS ACT.

Further, in its Regulatory Impact Analysis Statements the Department of Justice did not provide Parliament with an estimate of all the major additional costs that would be incurred. This disclosure was required by the government's regulatory policy. The costs incurred by the provincial and territorial agencies in enforcing the legislation were not reported. In addition, costs that were incurred by firearms owners, firearms clubs, manufacturers, sellers, and importers and exporters of firearms, in their efforts to comply with the legislation were not reported. 

Source: Report of the Auditor General of Canada – December 2002, Paragraph 10.29 – Page 6.

 

4.  THE JUSTICE MINISTER SAID THAT PARLIAMENT WILL HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL FALL FOR HIM TO TABLE HIS “CONSOLIDATED REPORT” ON THE TOTAL COST OF THE GUN REGISTRY.

A. The KPMG audit did not, as Cauchon had indicated it would, tally costs borne by other government departments information Auditor General Sheila Fraser complained she was unable to get because the Justice Department failed to gather it.  Canadians will have to wait until fall for that figure, Cauchon said.  "We're working together to make sure we will have the consolidated report and I'm sure we will be able to table the consolidated report this fall,"

Source: The Moncton Times and Transcript,Gun registry questions remain unanswered; Two reports on gun registry don't answer key questions, say critics” – Page C12, February 4, 2003.

B. The reports tabled by Mr. Cauchon yesterday do not provide the overall costs of the program, and the Justice Minister told reporters that tally may not come until fall -- long after government and opposition MPs are asked to approve a new gun registry budget.

Source: The National Post – “Review finds $400M lost on gun registry: 'Unnecessarily complex': Money spent on databases will never be recovered” - Page A4, February 4, 2003.

5.  JUSTICE MINISTER CAUCHON SAID THAT HE “TOTALLY” ACCEPTS ALL THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE AUDITOR GENERAL.

A.  Mr. Speaker, we totally accept the Auditor General's recommendations. It is sound policy. The question is could we do more, could we do better? Yes, we can do better. We are firmly committed to do so.

Source: Justice Minister Martin Cauchon – December 4, 2002, Hansard – Pages 2204.

B.  However, the Auditor General stated, and I agree, that we need to do better. We have to get the administration of this important public safety program back on track and do it in a cost-effective manner that Canadians can support.    I understand the concerns expressed in the Auditor General's report and in the House. I have made a commitment to the House to carefully examine the costs and the administration of the program, to make improvements and to be transparent in my efforts to do these things. I am fulfilling my commitments.

Source: Justice Minister Martin Cauchon – December 12, 2002, Hansard – Pages 2591-2592.

C.  Beyond that, as the Minister pointed out, we have agreed to accept all of the recommendations of the Auditor General in her report. Those recommendations do go to more transparent reporting and we intend to comply with those and I think we've followed that—

Source:  Testimony of the Deputy Minister of Justice Morris Rosenberg before the House of Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues]

 

6.  THE AUDITOR GENERAL RECOMMENDS THAT THE CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM HAVE ITS OWN “BUSINESS LINE” IN THE MAIN ESTIMATES.

One thing I think that would have perhaps avoided some of the confusion that has occurred recently is, for instance, there's mention of $113 million of planned spending in the report of Plans and Priorities. It would have also been helpful, I think, if there had been a breakdown under that to say how much was in the main estimates--$47 million--and $72 million expected in supplementary estimates. I think that would have cleared up some of the confusion that's been in the House this past week because the planned spending included both main estimates and planned supplementary estimates.

Source:  Testimony of Mrs. Sheila Fraser, Auditor General of Canada before the House of Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues].

7.  JUSTICE MINISTER ADMITS THAT NO ONE CAN TELL WHAT IS TO BE SPENT ON THE GUN CONTROL PROGRAM BY LOOKING AT THE MAIN ESTIMATES.

If I may, Mr. Chairman, I just would like to tell you that the report on plan and priorities that we have tabled for the fiscal year 2002-2003 is a report where you find exactly the numbers to be invested in the program for the year 2002-2003, and you find it in a separate item.  Of course, as we said before--and I guess as has been mentioned as well by the Auditor General in a previous year--we were respecting the rules of Treasury Board and reporting to one item and when you looked at that item, obviously it doesn't tell you what amount exactly would be spent for the Gun Control Program.

Source:  Testimony of Justice Minister Martin Cauchon before the House of Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues].

8.  THE AUDITOR GENERAL REPORTED THAT THE CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM IS A “MAJOR CROWN PROJECT” AND REPORTING REQUIREMENTS TO PARLIAMENT WERE NOT MET.

The issue we brought up is that this program was classified as a major crown project and there were certain reporting requirements that should have been met. There should have been details of a description of the project, the various departments and agencies that were involved in it, the total expenditures to date and planned expenditures for future years, major milestones and progress reports and other things. So as a major crown project, which the firearms program was, this reporting should have been in the departmental performance report.

Source:  Testimony of Mrs. Sheila Fraser, Auditor General of Canada before the House of Commons Standing Committee on Public Accounts – Monday, February 24, 2003 [unedited blues].

9.  JUSTICE MINISTER CAUCHON TABLED THE MAIN ESTIMATES WITHOUT A SEPARATE “BUSINESS LINE” FOR THE CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM.

Main Estimates – 2003-2004 – Justice Department [See Page 15-5]

http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/est-pre/20032004/002_e.pdf

Contributions to the provinces and territories for the Canadian Firearms Program = $18,000,000

NOTE: This is the only reference to the Firearms Program in the entire 341-page Estimates document tabled in Parliament February 26, 2003

Treasury Board News Release – February 26, 2003

http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2003/0226A_e.asp

- $74 million for the Canadian Firearms Centre - Department of Justice. The 2003-2004 Main Estimates will include a total of $113.1 million for the Canadian Firearms Centre for the first year's implementation of the action plan;

10.  JUSTICE MINISTER CAUCHON RELEASED DETAILED SPENDING ESTIMATES FOR THE GUN REGISTRY TO THE MEDIA ONE MONTH BEFORE HE WILL TABLE THIS INFORMATION IN PARLIAMENT.

Martin Cauchon, the Justice Minister, faced renewed accusations yesterday that he has failed to provide Parliament with clear financial information on the controversial national firearms program after his department requested another $172-million to keep it running.  The funding request was part of the federal government's annual spending estimates, which it tabled in the Commons yesterday.  Opposition critics attacked the government for failing to provide a proper accounting of the program, including cost breakdowns, despite being urged to as recently as this week by Sheila Fraser, the Auditor-General. The complete cost estimates are revealed in a government news release, which, unlike the estimates, are not tabled in Parliament.  "They continue to keep Parliament in the dark," said Alliance MP John Williams, chairman of the Commons public accounts committee. "I have never heard of us being able to appropriate money through a news release."

The news release says the Justice department will spend $113-million on the national firearms program in fiscal year 2003-2004. Mr. Cauchon also tabled supplementary estimates in Parliament yesterday, which make a specific request for $59-million to fund the program to the end of the current fiscal year. Combined, the total request for firearms program money is $172-million. Mike Murphy, a spokesman for Mr. Cauchon, said the more detailed breakdown contained in the news release will be tabled in Parliament in late March.

Source: The National Post – “Gun registry needs another $172-million” - Page A4, February 27, 2003.

NOTE:  This is a copy of the document that was handed out to the media by the Justice Minister's Press Secretary, Mike Murphy.  The same information was not made available to Members of Parliament.

http://www.cssa-cila.org/garryb/publications/cauchon'sexplanationofestimates2003-04.pdf

 

11.  THE JUSTICE MINISTER’S SPENDING ESTIMATES FOR 2003-2004 INCREASED BY $18.1 MILLION SINCE THEIR MARCH 21, 2002 ESTIMATES.

 

The Justice Department’s Report on Plans and Priorities for 2002-2003 estimated that the Canadian Firearms Program would cost $95 million in fiscal year 2003-2004 (See page 11).

http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/est-pre/20022003/jus-jus/jus0203rpp02_e.asp

 

The Treasury Board News Release dated February 26, 2003, states: The 2003-2004 Main Estimates will include a total of $113.1 million for the Canadian Firearms Centre for the first year's implementation of the action plan;

http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/media/nr-cp/2003/0226A_e.asp

 

12.  ON DECEMBER 5, 2002 THE HOUSE OF COMMONS “REPUDIATED” THE CANADIAN FIREARMS PROGRAM BY UNANIMOUSLY REFUSING THE JUSTICE MINISTER’S REQUEST FOR $72 MILLION IN FUNDING.  NOTHING HAS REALLY CHANGED IN THE LAST THREE MONTHS - PARLIAMENT IS STILL BEING KEPT IN THE DARK!

 

Excerpt from Hansard for Wednesday, February 12, 2003 – Pages 3471-3472:

http://www.parl.gc.ca/37/2/parlbus/chambus/house/debates/058_2003-02-12/HAN058-E.htm

 

Mr. Roger Gallaway (Sarnia—Lambton, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, I rise on a question of privilege arising from the justice minister's response to the question posed by the member for Huron--Bruce during yesterday's question period. I will be brief, as others may feel as I do that this is a matter of extreme importance to the House's overview and approval of public moneys, that is, the public purse. The minister stated: “ --up until the approval of the supplementary estimates, we were moving with what we call cash management.... The program is running at minimum cost but we are able to fulfill our duty.”  That raises, I submit, an important question of privilege.

On Thursday, December 5 of last year, on a motion by the member for Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, the House reduced by an amount of approximately $72 million the supplementary estimates on votes 1a and 5a. The House agreed and voted on that reduction. The government has attempted to manipulate the public perception of this act by spinning the myth that it was the justice minister who withdrew those supplementary estimates.

That $72 million had been dedicated to the national firearms program. That motion of reduction carried in the House. That motion was the unequivocally clear expression of this chamber to disallow those moneys to the minister. To state otherwise would be patently false and misleading. The record is clear.

There is an unequivocal principle in our House that the estimates are the financial expressions of government policy. In brief, the approval of the estimates is the signal to bring on the adoption and consideration of the appropriation bill. In fact, Beauchesne's sixth edition, paragraph 968(1) states: “The concurrence by the House in the Estimates is an Order of the House to bring in a bill, known as the Appropriation Bill, based thereon.”

By that December motion to reduce the Minister of Justice's estimates for the firearms program, the House laid down two principles. First, it ordered that no moneys for the national firearms program be included in the appropriation bill. Second, it clearly stated its disapproval, this chamber's disapproval, of the national firearms program. It repudiated the program by ordering no more money for it.